Random Thoughts before Sports Day

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I thought Elysia REALLY wore a cool hat last Sunday. It took me almost a week before I posted it up. It’s been a busy “adjustment” week.

There’s so much to drink in this week … great time at MMU CF (especially the supper), some insightful chat sessions, visited one LiFE Group (eavesdropped another), met up with a number of people (long overdue but better late than never), fixed up some new appointments, participated in my first denomination Executive council meeting … no wonder I’m physicially pretty worn out.

We’re suppose to start packing … wow! There’s a lot to do … need to start my part :-P

Excited for Gareth afterwards, the Canon A70 camera is ready … the weather is great, the Sun is shining.

I still haven’t blogged about the recent Lutheran denomination convention yet .. .

I need a haircut … it’s getting hot!

More … later.

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Random Thoughts after some encouraging posts

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James (when are you going to blog agani?) said I should take these pictures (when my A70 Canon digital camera was acting weird and producing these “pretty fuzzy” photos. I suppose the “redemptive” part of me just could resist …

A certain Mr. Khoo came to this garden dropped a comment and probably didn’t realize that it was comment no. 1000 here. So, a present awaits you :-) surprise!?

Reading Didn’t go to church … and I don’t wanna go … but yet I do helps me see what’s going on inside one who’s part of our church family … I guess there’s no point in denying the stuggles and the messiness – it’s there .. I like the realism that’s birthed though .. and most importantly – Hope .

Read a quote in line with the paragraph above from Kyle Potter’s post “Community is hard to come by”.

” I’m not moving again. People here grudgingly accept us, and that’s rare.

- overheard on “King of the Hill”

Need to get back to reading the dead Mr. S.K (Danish) again.. and engage the living Mr. S.K (Malaysian).

I was almost moved to tears (and with a lummp in my throat) when I stayed back a little and hid at a corner and saw Gareth (who’s just going to turn 3 in October) join in with the older kids for a choreographed flag dance. He was REALLY good! There was one moment when he turned around … and saw his papa – me look at him, I smiled in affirmation and pride. He looked like he kind of knew what I meant as by my smile and carried on. It’s mornings like this that makes one believe in a God of love even more.

So, even though our lives often aren’t picture perfect, and might even become “pretty fuzzy” for whatever reason or even no reason … it doesn’t mean there is no beauty, or can’t be anything worthwhile, or all complaints and frustrations …

I found these words from a young friend simple and yet profound (wisdom beyond his age!)…
“Life, well…..there are just so many beautiful things bout it. Look around you, feel, savour. Beautiful.

And you know the thing about pain in life. The hurts, the failures, the diasappointments….? Those things in life which leave you empty, in agony, in hopelessness. Didn’t God turn the most painful things in life, into some of the most beautiful experiences?

What bout life.
Life is beautiful beautiful.”

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Humble Answers to Honest Questions

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I came back pretty late last night. Kelvin and Kia Meng joined me last night for this invitation to facilitate at MMU Christian Fellowship (I’m really happy that what I desire very often like Bangsar Lutheran Church members coming with me in CF engagements came true to some extent yesterday – most of the time its hard because of timing).

I didn’t know what to fully expect apart from perhaps there would be newcomers even those from other faiths as well as perhaps even friends who would see themselves as non-religious. I found it very helpful that some of the committee members actually met up with me earlier last Friday to give me some context on what is the climate and direction of the CF and their members. I found it interesting and noteworthy that for some and it seems many are beginning to ask more “questions” and moving in and out of re-examining their faith.

This may be unsettling for some, and downright scary for others … and yet, deep down I was happy that they are “working through” rather than “evading” the questions. Now the promo invitation card looks very “apologetics” and I was quite tickled when I was invited (because I’m NOT known to be an “apologetics” expert). But what they wanted me to do was to facilitate “conversations” and more of a “dialogue” (as opposed to debate) .. ah .. that I can do! So, I was pretty excited about last night.

During our pre-meeting last friday, they past me a list of questions “itching” their members. I actually re-catergorized them yesterday and saw some interesting patterns … I’ll just post up the one under the catergory of Christ as a sample:


“1. So, all other religions go to hell? Why doesn’t all good people go to heaven?
2. There is Heaven & Hell and Jesus is the only way to Heaven, why is God so cruel to let those unsaved go to Hell? Why Christian is the only way? Why not other religion?
3. If you believe in God, but do not believe in Jesus is the only way then how? How about people who believe in God generally but not particularly Jesus?
4. Do babies/kids who do not know Jesus go to heaven?5. Is it once you believe in Jesus, you can go to heaven? But after that, didn’t do anything as Christian cans still go to Heaven?
6. What is the significance of the cross? Are Christians praying to the cross?
7. What distinguish Christianity from other religions?”

For me it wasn’t just that these questions were asked. I digged deeper and am trying to understand why these questions were asked and what is the story behind these questions. Seems to me that the Gospel is presented in a way that the questions are framed in these ways. so, apart from taking these honest questions as it is, I was also thinking about how new questions could be introduced. I was also thinking about introducing ways of understanding the Christian life beyond the limiting “heaven/hell” approach. Well, we didn’t manage to talk i detail about the above questions in the session (because it was not raised) but we did at some point after the meeting during supper :-) isn’t that typical Malaysian (or perhaps it’s the same worldwide or it’s just human)?

Back to the meeting … after a little intro sharing that we are here to gather questions people have and then give space for everyone to contribute (especially the Christians to share their answers) I was delighted to see the non-CF members/friends/guests also participating.

Basically, we broke out into 5 groups – under the topics: Christ, Church, Ethics, Bible & any other questions. After gathering the questions, we exchanged the questions with another group and then they would share their responses and answers to the questions given and present them to everyone. After each presentation, I’d chip in my comments and suggest further thought/questions.

I tried my best to respect the “others” amongst us … and present and facilitate the sessions “humbly” because even though there were differences (and some points interesting similarities) we need to model how to honor the “other” person unlike us and prayefully IMHO allow the Spirit to do his work. It felt like “inter-religious” dialogue at a very grass-root & informal level for me last night, and to see how the “good news” can be presented without any pressure to “convert” people prematurely (and definately not manipulatively).

We just shared our story … our concerns .. our values … even our struggles … our limitations … who we are, what we are called to do .. where we have failed, where we need to move on etc,… and in all this authentically trusting in Jesus’ presence with us to guide us and lead us. It was awesome for me and very heart-warming (of course, due to minimal air-con physically it was warm too). At a deeper level, it was more than a change in style … like it wasn’t a lecture and more participatibe .. it’s was actually a change in our attitudes, or in other words, a more intentional way to listen, share, and interact in the way of Jesus.

I was reminded yesterday when we were driving to the meeting of something I shared at a camp recently – that We are learning to Converse with the REAL people before us rather than the IMAGINARY stereo-types which may or may not exist. There’s more to apologetics than giving well argued answers. and we need to consciously integrate our mediums with our message and allow space for mystery and model maturity.

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Random Links 58

Reality Church?
Useful way to think through where one is in relation to “church” … and perhaps offer hope? (This Nouwen Reflection on forgiving the Church is worth reading again!)

Thank You Josh McDowell (sort of)
The usefulness and not usefulness of apologetics … finding it’s appropriate place?

Faith & Science: Opposition or Necessary Complemantarity
I spend two days listening to some of his talks on other subjects last Monday and Tuesday.

The Current State of Lutheran Systematic Theology
interesting overview … tempts me to get some books.

Virtual theology
I downloaded everything … I prefer the hand written notes – somehow it’s more human and personal … hmm..

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A Big Idea for Pastors

A couple of things struck me in the following quote. First, is the simple focus in disciple making. Second, my personal life verse John 20:21 is mentioned (and it’s also the focus verse for our church). Third, is when Brian mentioned about the benediction – that is exactly what’s in my mind when I announce it EVERY time EVERY Sunday for me, my family and all those present. I’m REALLY looking forward to return to BLC after being away for 2 Sundays :-)


“Our job is to make disciples. Our job is to actually make people who are followers of Jesus and who have a role in this world similar to the role that Jesus had in this world. Jesus said, “As the Father sent me, so send I you.” We’re actually preparing people to be sent into the world.

Every Sunday when we say the benediction, we’re sending them into the world as representatives of Jesus. And so what did Jesus do? Jesus taught, Jesus asked questions. Jesus loved people. Jesus healed. Jesus spoke up about injustice and exposed hypocrisy. If we had a sense that what the Christian project is all about is actually about sending people a little better prepared week after week to represent Jesus, I think that would be a tremendously exciting thing. And in many ways this is really what this whole emergent conversation is about. How we can actually rise to that mission of making disciples.” ~ Brian McLaren, A Generous, not Suspicious, Orthodoxy

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Catching Up with Emergent Stuff and more…

I haven’t been posting a lot relating directly to the Emergent Conversation lately … but I’m still catching up with the it myself after quite a busy few weeks :-)

Unraveling Emergent
here are some of Doug’s phrases that caught my attention:
“As Christ-centered people, many of us understand the Gospel in terms of Jesus’ radical, profound, and expansive message of the kingdom of God. ”

“Within many of us there is a desire for the Good News of Jesus to really be good news for the people of the world and not just the promise of a world to come.”

“Emerging churches often speak of themselves as if they were a family where the love and commitment to one another is deep, meaningful and essential”

“More than seeing their role as setting forth a bold vision (mission statement) and asking God to bless it, we seek to join God in the work of the kingdom wherever it is found. ”

“Emerging churches believe that friendships change people. They stress that Jesus welcomed the original disciples into a warm friendship with himself and one another. Through the centuries the church has been an extension of this friendship through space, time, and transition.”

“Emerging churches are often vigilant in their assertion that what they are about is not merely changing the methods of their faith; they are seeking to be full theological communities. “

On Emergent
So it’s more than just about relevance … read on … “… providing a space for the conversation is messy and feelings get hurt. But for the many youth pastors who suffer angst over what they are doing — that it falls short, that there must be more than simply a relevant church service with a large stage, candles, painters going at it, tables, videos, and irreverent banter, Emergent provides hope. … Emergent provides a place for these travelers to tell their stories, to deconstruct, and yes, eventually to reconstruct their faith. For those who listen carefully and long enough, it is not about Christians losing their faith, but finding it once again as well.”

Knight Ridder Piece on the Emerging Church
Stephen is right on this, “I think I read once that when you are deeply involved in something and then the news media covers it, that you see how sometimes major news media miss the nuances.” That’s why second hand news even if it’s in print (and especially if it’s on the web) can be misleading … but we need to rise above these weaknesses and limitations in media with mature discernment. After reading a news piece (or even a statement which troubles us), sending an email or giving a phonecall to clarify first before jumping into conclusions (or before fossilizing our views on others) isn’t that hard nowadays isn’t it?

Brian McLaren is the real thing…
Ryan Bolger does a good scan of Brian’s books and shares his admiration for the man.

There’s A Bigger Story: Brian Mclaren
Here’s a cool quote, “one of the amazing things about the Bible is that it does not try to say, “Either choose our story or choose the other guys story.” What the Bible does again and again is it outflanks the competing stories and in some ways tries to redeem them.”

McLaren: ‘Finding the Right Words Is Difficult’
“”I don’t like the term ‘emergent church,’ ” says the pastor of the non-denominational Cedar Ridge Community Church in the Washington, D.C. area. “It sort of sets up a division like there is this church or that church. I like to talk about an emergent conversation.”" Now that’s a fantastic opening which I fully say AMEN ! to …

A Generous, not Suspicious, Orthodoxy
On A lot of people have trouble explaining or understanding what the emergent church is. (*note*: personally I’m still uncomfortable with the term “Emergent Church” here but Brian’s reply is pretty consistent with the word “conversation”), “The reason people have trouble is because all of us have trouble with this. There is a lot of diversity of opinion about any issue you could raise. People feel I am being evasive when I say this, but a conversation is the best word for it. In a conversation you have people saying different things about the same thing. A statement, a counter-statement, a question, an answer. Everyone is not just saying the same thing, but they’re dealing with the same set of problems. And what the emergent conversation is about is people dealing with the problems of living in a post-colonial, postmodern, post-enlightenment and maybe post-denominational world.”

and more ….

“It’s not just having conversations, but about practitioners who are trying things and talking about what’s working and not working and trying to tell one another about some advice about how to deal with this. So it’s people engaged in church ministry, working with the poor, working internationally, and that sort of thing. So we’re sharing in that practice of theology.”

Who Has the Last Word? An Interview with Brian McLaren
This is an engaging interview …
“Dan Knauss:
Does loving one another as Christians across confessional boundaries mean never discussing or taking seriously our differences, or even acknowledging they exist?

Brian McLaren:
I would never say this. My books are attempts to open up space for respectful dialogue about our differences. In fact, it is our differences that give us a lot to talk about. The key, it seems to me, is that we do so not as enemies but as brothers and sisters … and that we do so not in attack but in mutual edification.”

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Interlude: What’s Next?

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I thought I’ll just dwell in a little “interlude” before more reports & reflections of the recent events. Resonating what the new Bishop Philip Lok of the Lutheran Church in Malaysia said in his speech last sunday, I too am still in a stage to allow the implications of our corporate decisions to settle in. More importantly, I find myself opening up space for imaginations to emerge. What are the dangers and opportunities before us?

*side story: before the convention the frame for my glasses snapped and broke, and I needed to dig out my old pair from years ago to get through the convention and this week – that’s why I look strange if you notice – but this little incident made to “redeem” the discomfort as a sign that before “looking forward” with new pairs of glasses (I got two pairs made – perhaps signifying multi=perspectives) I want to understand our denomination backwards before living forward together (Thanks to Kierkergaard for this insight)*

When Gareth and I were having breakfast yesterday, he enjoying bread and cereal while I was having my coffee. These words from Miroslav Volf caught my attention in his pieace “Theology, Meaning and Power” in the Future of theology (it”s quite a long quote but worth it – which I also see has relevance for ecclesiology in our context):

“A theology appropriate to multilingual people living in a functionally differentiated and culturally pluralistic societies should be conceived primarily a nonsystemic and critical intellectual endeavor … In a time of “increasing interdependence cultural diversity and historic change, Stephen Toulmin argued, the intellectual task before natural and social sciences is “not to build new, more comprehensive systems of theory with universal and timeless relevance, but to limit the scope of even the best-framed theories, and fight the intellectual reductionism that became entrenched during the ascendency of rationalism.” We shoulld “pay less attention to stability and system, more attention to function and adaptability“. The same, I would argue holds true for theology. The more systemically rigorous and timeless our theologies are, the less useful they will be in the diverse situations of our fast-changing cultures (which by no means entails the claim that the least systemically rigorous theology –a haphazard conglomeration of theological assertions — will be the most useful). Does theology so conceived forfeit its universal claim? To the contrary: It is because “Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, and today and forever,” it is because Christian faith is for all times and all places, that our theologies need to be nonsystemic, contextual and flexible.”

I’m chewing on this for a while especially when in our context where faith often is less reflective and to some extend we are rationally not so rigorous, the temptation is to move towards becoming over rigid in order to gain an illusory or even utopian stability in the life of the church assuming this is a higer order compared to a so called “baby faith” or even “blind faith”. And yet, I do not propose we become “irrational” or “haphazard”.

What I sense is a better way forward is to recognize the role of “reason” or more linear kinds of rationality its rightful place without over accenting it (often unknowingly downplaying the experiential and what I call “different kinds of rationality” that’s non-linear). What is true for theological construction in our context would also be true IMHO for ecclesiological construction (or reconstruction or renovation) where we give up an illusory and not-realistic expectation or even obsession with thinking framed by words like “stability” and “systems” (but not ignoring it’s role as well as limitations and contribution) and get on with dealing with what’s before us with more attentions on “function” and “adaptability”

(note: it’s a matter of what gets more attention while keeping a keen awareness of the other aspects in mind).

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